Scott Walkers' influence on David?

[Astronaut]

Hi everyone! I've just watched a BBC4 documentary on Scott Walker, and since it's well known that David is a fan of his I was wondering if any of you have listened to his most recent works: "Tilt" and/or "The Drift"? If so, what did you think of them? And do you think Walkers' style has had a noticeable effect on Davids' work?

[sonic_chronicler]

Hi there,
The doc shown on BBC4 last night wasn't produced by the BBC, it was the work of Stephen Kijack. It has been given a limited cinema release and is available to buy on DVD; but that's not what you're asking.

Watching the doc, you will have heard significant extracts from Tilt & The Drift. What you can expect from the albums in full is more of the same. They certainly aren't for everyone, but if you are open to something a little different then they are very rewarding.

I personally love them. As a long standing Walker fan they didn't come as much of a surprise - their ancestry can be traced through elements of The Night Flights album, parts of Climate of Hunter and other signals here and there from the early solo albums.

There are definitely parallels between Scott & David's careers - their fanbases too. Remember how some people felt that Blemish was too much of a departure for Sylvian? I think the same count's for Walker's newer work - it's all there in the blueprint if you listen for it.

I think David probably takes inspiration (and maybe direction) from many artists, but if you ask is he directly influenced by modern Scott Walker, I think I'd say 'not in any major way'

It's interesting to me how 'pop' artists can mutate into 'serious' artists - granted it doesn't happen often, but when it does it can be (IMHO) some of the most interesting music out there - Witness Walker, Sylvian & Talk Talk

Sonic

[Astronaut]

Hello Sonic! Thanks for replying, and correcting me - you're quite right it wasn't a BBC production, I didn't mean to imply that it was - just sloppy posting on my part!

I have to say that after watching the documentary in full, and now that I've had time to digest what was said and think about the music, I can see similarities between Walker and Sylvian, but these I think are more in terms of temperament and inclination rather than musical direction. I personally love "Blemish" just the whole honesty of it and find it both exciting and intriguing. From what I heard last night of "Tilt" (I was already familiar with his work with the Walker Brothers and the Jacques Brel material) I can say that it doesn't interest me as much, however I wouldn't completely dismiss it, but I'm not sure it's something that I would listen to repeatedly. Having said that, I surprised myself at how much I warmed to "The Drift". Now that was very interesting and I will try to get a copy so I can experience the completed work. The interviewer asked Walker if he considered the tracks on "The Drift" to be 'songs' because one reviewer said they were not songs - he didn't specify what he thought they were - but Walker said emphatically that as far as he was concerned they were songs. What do you think?

[proggrl]

Well - they ARE songs. I don't know what else he'd call them. I haven't seen the docu in question, but perhaps he's never heard good songs before and didn't recognize one when he heard it.

I hear a lot of similarities between Walker and Sylvian - experimentalism, vocal timbre, influences, etc.

[Astronaut]

Hi Proggrl
Well I think the reviewer in question was just being facetious really. He was probably referring to the general lack of lyrical input because as we all know if it aint got any lyrics it aint a song :roll: I'd also like to add here that it's possible the content of "The Drift" goes beyond the description of 'song' it seems such an inadequate word for the material ... maybe I'm just reading too much into it (as usual!)

[Adrian]

first of all, it's a great documentary...
I love both Scott and David, both Tilt/The Drift (can't choose) and Blemish being in my top ten of all times.
I don't think there's a real influence of either artist on the other, but I do seem to remember rumours of a collaboration that quickly ended, somewhere in the late 80-s (?)

[Astronaut]

Yes Adrian, David was asked about that during an interview with Skullcave FM in 2006:

"Speaking of Scott Walker there was a rumour around that it was muted that you and he would collaborate at a time, did that have any basis in fact?"
"Yes, Scott and I met a few times and I’d written a piece which I thought suited him and he liked it and he wanted to elaborate on it and produce a full album. But at that time he was signed to Virgin and he was in a very unfortunate position because he had to abandon an album with Brian that he had started some years before. Virgin would no longer allow him into the studio without him providing demos and you know, somebody who’s got stature you just don’t ask them to provide demos for his work, so he was in a kind of catch 22 position there and I just wanted to help him out of a jam; so I said I would go ahead and help him work through this situation with Virgin. Nothing ever came of it and ultimately he was bought out of the contract by another label which, was very fortunate for him I think and he managed to pull together “Tilt” as a result which is a tremendous album. But it was interesting meeting him and it was interesting talking our way through ideas for a project but it was kind of obvious from the early days that it wasn’t going to develop into anything concrete."

Which is a real shame - can you imagine what that might have turned out like?

[sonic_chronicler]

Also of note is Scott Walker's most recent release "And Who Shall Go To The Ball, And What Shall Go To The Ball?" Which is a short instrumental album composed to accompany a Rafael Bonachela dance piece.

It is a limited release, out of stock at 4ad, but probably kicking around somewhere. 4ad do offer it as a cheap download.
Sonic

[Astronaut]

Thanks for that info Sonic! If you were asked to recommend a list of maybe 10 tracks by Scott Walker for a new fan, what would they be? As I said before I'm familiar with The Walker Bros and some of the Brel inspired material but after that, I'm a bit lost, theres a lot to listen to and some guidance would be good ... ?

[sonic_chronicler]

A great starting place for anyone wanting to investigate Scott is the 'Boy Child ' compilation - it is out of print, but can still be picked up cheaply - it only covers up to 1970, but what a collection!

If you are looking to investigate Scott 'post 60's' you should probably avoid most of the solo output until 'Climate Of Hunter' The one exception is 'til the band comes in' which certainly has its moments.

First stop - the track 'No Regrets' from the walker brothers re-union album of the same name. You'll probably be familiar with the song - Midge Ure did a cover in the 80s for one.

After that - the four 'Scott' tracks from the Walker Brothers 'Nite Flights' most notably 'The Electrician' Listen to that one and tell me Sylvian wasn't a fan. 'Rain Tree Crow'

Climate Of Hunter onwards, through Tilt & The Drift, I'd find it difficult to pick out individual tracks to recommend as what would appeal to one person would almost certainly turn someone else off. You should be aware that somewhere along the line Scott (mostly) changed his vocal style. He now seldom sings in his 'crooner' style, preferring to emote in a higher register which can sometimes seem a little strained - however....

Climate Of Hunter - Suffers a little from 80's production, but features some notable guests - Mark Isham and even bloomin' Mark Knopfler puts in a good turn (on the cover of 'BlanketRoll Blues'). 'Sleepwalkers Woman' is probably the stand out track for me, very slow and elegant, I can hear the seeds of Tilt in there.

Tilt - Well, if people had ignored 'Climate Of Hunter' (Virgin's poorest selling album ever I believe) that wasn't about to happen with Tilt - it got a lot of press - much of the popular press going 'WTF!' It is a sensational piece of work - uncompromising, strange and beautiful - listen to the opening track 'Farmer In The City' If its ominous tones appeal, buy the rest of the album. Expect tiny noises and walls of sound - this is uneasy listening at its finest. I always think 'Bolivia 95' wouldn't be too out o place performed by Rain Tree Crow.

The Drift takes the sound ideas of Tilt and extrapolates them. Wierdly some people who love Tilt can't stand The Drift and vice versa - personally I find them to be fairly close cousins (albeit born more than a decade apart.) Purchase if you like the idea of sides of Beef used for percussion. Don't get me wrong, it's fantastic stuff, just I wouldn't pick it as a starting point for most people.

If you yearn for the Scott of old, then even here you can be satisfied. He has contributed to a select few soundtracks - generally in the rich woice of old... 'Man From Reno' from a Toxic Affair is great - it's probably on one of the podcasts on my website somewhere, but I can't remember where. 'I threw It All Away' from 'To Have & To Hold' is a beautiful Lushly orchestrated track - worked with Nick Cave on that one. He also collaborated with David Arnold on the Bond Film 'The World Is Not enough' 'Only Myself To Blame' is the track you are looking for. Then there's 'Pola X' soundtrack to the film of the same name - I always think of it as a kind of extension of Tilt as it contains some elements from that album, but it does stand on its own too.

It's worth hearing some of the (little) stuff he has produced or written for others - Pulp's 'We Love Life' is one of their best and Ute Lemper's 'Punishing Kiss' is quite interesting - also featuring work from Nick Cave, Elvis Costello, Philip Glass, and Neil Hannon,

....and for completists only... 'Darkness' from 'Plague Songs' a jolly ditty from a collection of songs about the ten Plagues of Egypt described in the book of Exodus. Oh, and the afore mentioned '....And Who Shall Go To The Ball...'

Does that help? No, thought not. Summary - 60's solo - classic. 70's solo mostly poor and out of print. 80's solo - interesting. 90's solo - Genius. 00's solo continues to be peerless.

Sonic

[Astronaut]

Does that help? No, thought not. Summary - 60's solo - classic. 70's solo mostly poor and out of print. 80's solo - interesting. 90's solo - Genius. 00's solo continues to be peerless.

LOL! Thank you so much Sonic. Yes, that certainly does help - it gives me something to focus on. Thank you for taking the time to write such a comprehensive reply.

So it's: Boy Child, Climate of Hunter, WB reunion album, 4 tracks from Nite Flites, Tilt, The Drift, Pola X, Plague songs, 'And who shall go to the ball?' and a few soundtrack compositions.

Many Thanks
Astronaut

[sonic_chronicler]

The walkers Re-umion doesn't contain too many highlights really. I'd just go for the title track. For information, Pola X is really difficult to track down in its original form.

If you find you like the newer Scott stuff, grab '...And Who Shall Go To The Ball....' because it is a 'never to be reprinted piece of music (if 4AD are to believed)

If you have any trouble tracking stuff down, drop me a PM

Sonic

[Astronaut]

Thank you Sonic! I'll do just that
Astronaut

[Hawk]

Ok I didn't want to start a new topic so I'll ask here... Call me ignorant but I'd never heard of Scott Walker until all of these Manafon reviews start saying how alike he and Sylvian are. Well...I've read through this topic and listened to some of the songs mentioned via Youtube...I know there is only so much one can learn in half an hour but from what I've heard I still really can't understand the resemblence! I mean, I can a bit, but only so much as Sylvian is a bit like Bowie and Bowie is a bit like Walker...through inspiration I suppose...but they all still sound completely different to me and it seems a bit of a dated argument. I just don't get why the Sylvian/Walker parallels are in virtually EVERY review as if it's something REALLY obvious... Maybe it's just me that doesn't get it?? I'm confused...

[Bern]

Hawk, I think the similarities betweeb Sylvian and Scott Walker lay in their career paths both were very successful artists who became reclusive, turned away from main stream music towards the more avant garde, Sylvian is a renowned Scott Walker fan and actually wrote "Ride" for him..pity he never recorded it