Rain tree crow- who else found it disappointing at the time.

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Rain tree crow- who else found it disappointing at the time.

Postby liberty boy on Sun Feb 24, 2008 5:20 pm

I think the unprepossessing cover somehow said it all. It definitely lacked that something special associated with japan. David Sylvian said they had alot of joy making it- before the well documented problems. i think for the listener improvisations aren't really that enjoyable. Though I do like words with the shamen and plight and premonition. I guess rock improvisations can seem more meaningful to the musicians involved than to the fans who'rd probably rather hear something more conventionally sat down and composed.
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Re: Rain tree crow- who else found it disappointing at the t

Postby VaporTrail on Sun Feb 24, 2008 5:31 pm

liberty boy wrote:I think the unprepossessing cover somehow said it all. It definitely lacked that something special associated with japan. David Sylvian said they had alot of joy making it- before the well documented problems. i think for the listener improvisations aren't really that enjoyable. Though I do like words with the shamen and plight and premonition. I guess rock improvisations can seem more meaningful to the musicians involved than to the fans who'rd probably rather hear something more conventionally sat down and composed.


I personally don't think RTC sounds anything like an album of improvisations. Yes, the material on the album was born of improvs, but the end result sounds very tight and "composed".
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Postby Astronaut on Sun Feb 24, 2008 5:51 pm

I have to agree with Vapor. When I first listened to the album I did so without reference to the liner notes and I had no idea whatsoever that it was improv. NONE. It was/is very "composed" as Vapor said. In fact, when I read the notes I was very surprised that it was put together from improv sessions, to be able to come up with material of that quality on the 'spur of the moment' is really quite something. I personally think it's a fantastic album, and shows how much they had all developed professionally in the 6 or 7 years since they previously recorded together.
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Postby sonic_chronicler on Sun Feb 24, 2008 8:02 pm

Sorry, can't agree liberty boy.

In the UK the album was preceded by the single "Blackwater" it set the mood perfectly for me. Knowing all the stuff the seperate members had been doing it didn't come as anything of a shock. I think the material is pretty well structured. It really showed the members had all matured from the early 80s

I suppose if someone was going from Tin Drum to RTC then maybe they would have been disappointed.

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Postby natsume on Sun Feb 24, 2008 9:23 pm

I really loved it when it came out. The first time I knew of the album was overhearing, quite randomly, Blackwater, in a stereo store, in California, no less. They and/or Sylvian were never big here, so rare to hear them in public anyway. Already being a huge fan of Sylvian's first three solo albums, I found RTC to be very welcome and fresh sounding. And maybe for an American from the Southwest, there is also something there that rang a little closer to home than anything else that I had heard from this group of musicians before. I hear tones, themes, and evocations of the American Southwest in this music. Sylvian has only really returned to these moods of desert beauty on the Dobro tracks, and some other parts of DBOAC, and now the track with Joan Wasser on Steve's album.
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Postby baht habit on Sun Feb 24, 2008 11:22 pm

>>>i think for the listener improvisations aren't really that enjoyable.<<<

Perhaps for the run-of-mill pedestrian listener of pop music that may be the case...but when a really strong improviser is flat out going for it on his or her chosen instrument and the inspiration is flowing and the technical facility is on a high level, then such fiery spontaneity can seldom be equalled. Fortunately for so many Jazz musicians that have dared to stretch musical boundaries and fortunately for so many listeners with open minds and open ears, your opinion isn't a universally shared viewpoint.


>>>I guess rock improvisations can seem more meaningful to the musicians involved than to the fans who'rd probably rather hear something more conventionally sat down and composed<<<

And those fans who would 'rather hear something more conventionally sat down and composed' are obviously free to seek out what they enjoy. They probably shouldn't be attempting to listen to something that is all that challenging anyhow.
In relation to Sylvian, I would hardly consider him to be rock and I would hardly consider him to be conventional.
I have a feeling you are just going to love his upcoming album...being that he has been working on it with such improvisational talents as Evan Parker, Martin Brandlmayr and the wildly experimental Keith Rowe. :-)
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Postby Lady Arcadia on Mon Feb 25, 2008 12:13 am

When RTC was released, I thought it wasn't too bad, it had a dark feeling to it, which I quite liked. It is a CD that has grown on me during the years.

I never saw it as improv recordings, but rather something with the "Sylvian polish".

It makes for quite a nice follow up to Tin Drum, (showing that all members of the band had moved forward), and it also stands well as a stand alone CD. It is a shame that we will probably never hear anything new with the collective that was Japan, but if it means getting new material by repeating the previous "tense moments" - forget it.
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Postby liberty boy on Mon Feb 25, 2008 5:22 am

Well I'll have to listen again and ponder it afresh. I have to say it did herald DS's rockist period The first day being my least favourite of post japan albums and I think conceded by the man himself as a bit of a wrong turning.

Coming from a fan of Pentangle and Nick Drake I always much prefer his work with strings, acoustic instruments and subtle synthesizer textures.
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Postby Silver Moon on Mon Feb 25, 2008 7:29 am

Liberty Boy,

For me, RTC was an album that had to grow on me. Same with a few other people I've talked to. Give it a few more listens sometime, or just put it on when you're cleaning or something, and you may just come to change your mind!

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Postby deadbees on Mon Feb 25, 2008 11:38 am

as much as i loved the album i would have preferred more songs as opposed to instrumental sketches and possibly a more upbeat track (lead off single) to gain more exposure
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Postby liberty boy on Mon Feb 25, 2008 12:25 pm

I think the titles put me off too. "Blackcrow Hits Show Shine City" ... I've happily followed him on alot of his directions but I guess this sudden move into his infatuation with things American and rock/funk fusion grooves seemed too much to take, especially when it came out. Inspite of his work with Fripp and Bill Nelson I guess i didn't see it coming especially after secrets of the beehive and I don't think i was quite ready to give up the last vestiges of the original new romantic dream - of the end of rock n roll and the dominance of American cultural references.
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Postby Simonp on Mon Feb 25, 2008 1:17 pm

Rain Tree Crow contains some wonderful tracks (Pocketful of Change, Blackwater and Every Colour You Are). But for every great track there are some real duffers (New Moon At Red Deer Wallow and Scratchings), I think as an album it's very consistent in sound and I'd much listen to rain Tree Crow than anything from Japan's back catalogue any day!
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Postby Astronaut on Mon Feb 25, 2008 2:13 pm

I'd much listen to Rain Tree Crow than anything from Japan's back catalogue any day!


Whoa! SimonP! :shock: That's fighting talk! :D Just kiddin' you're entitled to your opinion - but ...
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Postby Simonp on Mon Feb 25, 2008 3:41 pm

Astronaut wrote:
I'd much listen to Rain Tree Crow than anything from Japan's back catalogue any day!


Whoa! SimonP! :shock: That's fighting talk! :D Just kiddin' you're entitled to your opinion - but ...


I've never been into Japan. In fact I think i only own Tin Drum and Polaroids. Their music just didnt do it for me the way solo Sylvian did and does!
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Postby Sylvie on Mon Feb 25, 2008 4:14 pm

Simonp wrote:
Astronaut wrote:
I'd much listen to Rain Tree Crow than anything from Japan's back catalogue any day!


Whoa! SimonP! :shock: That's fighting talk! :D Just kiddin' you're entitled to your opinion - but ...


I've never been into Japan. In fact I think i only own Tin Drum and Polaroids. Their music just didnt do it for me the way solo Sylvian did and does!


Me neither actually. However hard I try, I always end up listening to GTE rather than Tin Drum.....
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